Radio Front Desk

How to move through shame and self-doubt as a clinic owner

• Jane.app • Season 2 • Episode 23

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Every clinic owner faces a season where things don’t feel perfect. But why do so few talk about it?

In this episode of Radio Front Desk, Denzil sits down with psychotherapist and clinic owner Roxanne Francis to talk about what it’s really like to run a clinic when things don’t feel as perfect as they look. 

Roxanne opens up about facing shame, comparison, and the pressure to appear put-together as she navigated growing a business. But she also opens up about how she found her footing again.


What You’ll Learn:

  • How to recognize and release the pressure to “have it all together” as a clinic owner
  • Why shame and comparison thrive in silence, and how to bring them into the light
  • What professional vulnerability looks like (and how to practice it safely)
  • Why your relationship with money is emotional, and how to rebuild trust with it

Guest Bio

Roxanne Francis is an award-winning psychotherapist, registered social worker, leadership coach, consultant, and international speaker with over 15 years of experience helping people transform their lives. As Founder and CEO of Francis Psychotherapy & Consulting Services, she leads a group practice, coaches and supervises therapists, and advises organizations on mental health, DEI, racial trauma, burnout, and women’s issues. 

Resources mentioned


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SPEAKER_01:

It just felt like the money was falling into a hole somewhere, right? The money wasn't moneying. And I saw other clinic owners who were scaling, and I was like, how are they doing this stuff? I actually said to her, I feel so small when I'm around them because it just feels like they have it all together. And she said, actually, I'll tell you this. Can't tell you all their details, but I can tell you that they don't have it all together.

SPEAKER_03:

Welcome back to Radio Front Desk by Jane App. I'm your host, Denzel Ford. When you run a small business, especially in healthcare, there's often this quiet pressure to make it look like everything's going smoothly. And yet, the truth is that struggle is a part of every clinic owner's story. My guest today is Roxanne Francis, a psychotherapist, speaker, and clinic owner who helps health and wellness professionals navigate both the business and emotional sides of care. In this episode, Roxanne shares what it's really like to run a business when things don't feel as perfect as they look. We talk about the shame and comparison that comes with entrepreneurship, the moments she doubted herself during financial uncertainty, and how she finally found her footing again. Let's get into it. Roxanne, welcome to Radio Front Desk. How are you today?

SPEAKER_01:

I'm doing good. Thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_03:

I'm so glad you're here. Last time we saw each other, we were in Palm Springs. So now we're in Vancouver. We're in Vancouver. Very fun. I'm really excited to dig in with you on a very special and maybe specific topic today. What it means to be honest about struggle as a clinic owner. So let's start by naming the elephant in the room that when you run a small business, there's a pressure to make it look like everything is going right and you have it together. Yeah. But the reality can be very different. Yes. So could you start by letting us know like what have you been hearing?

SPEAKER_01:

Um what I'm actually hearing is that people are saying, people are falling into that comparison trap, right? So they're saying those other people running those clinics look like they have it done perfectly, and I don't. And so I feel like I'm failing, right? They're like, they're so successful, they're, you know, running the show, they're doing all these fancy things, and I'm not. And I wonder what it is that I'm doing wrong. And it it lends to this sense of shame in a way.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, that makes sense. Do you have any personal experience like that you could share like a time when you felt that way as a clinic owner?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, for sure. Um, I think maybe in year two or year three of my business, and we were starting to scale, and I felt like I it just felt like the money was falling into a hole somewhere, right? The money wasn't moneying. And I saw other clinic owners who were scaling, and I was like, how are they doing this stuff? And I actually invested in a financial strategist. And so we were going through our financial plan. And so she showed me, she was like, This is the hole, and we this is how we can fix it. And I was like, Oh my goodness. Here I was thinking that I was somehow like I didn't know what I was doing or I was bad at this or whatever. And she goes, No, a lot of people fall into this trap. And I I actually said to her, you know, such and such person, I feel so small when I'm around them because it just feels like they have it all together. And she said, actually, I'll tell you this. Can't tell you all of their details, but I can tell you that they don't have it all together on the, you know, behind the scenes, right? Right. And so it really just is um, it was a reminder to me that everyone has their own issue or situation and they just don't, we don't lead with that, right? And rightfully so. There's some things you want to keep private. But because we only look at the the the fun stuff or the the social media highlight reel, even though we know it's a highlight reel, we still look at what people choose to show us and compare it to the nuts and bolts of what we've got going on. And it makes us feel like we're not doing the right thing or we're not good enough or we're we're we're too small, or you know, yes, it's not a good situation.

SPEAKER_03:

It's a very human topic as well. You know, there's many things that are equivalents to the social media highlight real in life, what car you drive, what house you live in, those sorts of things don't always signal that you do truly have it together. Exactly. So when you hired a financial advisor, I'm curious to just dig in real quick there. Like how because if I may, not all financial advisors are super great. You kind of need to find one that that, and I don't mean it that way, but I mean you do need to find one that it fits what you need. Yes. So could you just talk a bit about how you found that person and like what made you think that was the right person for you? And I don't know, like I'm I am curious a little about what you paid for them since you're talking about like losing money a little bit, right?

SPEAKER_01:

Yes. When I started my business, what I started in someone's group practice, and then when we when I, you know, we separated and I went out on my own, um, I knew that I needed help in terms of attracting clients. And so I worked with um a marketing coach for about we worked on and off for about six months. And during that period of time, she helped me come up with logo and colors and fonts and all these things, right? And in doing that, I got to become uh familiar with some of her community. She had a podcast and she interviewed this person, and I was like, oh, this woman sounds really smart and kind, right? And she the topic was about money. And I was listening to the podcast, folding clothes, going, oh, my money sucks, right? But listening to her thinking she really knows what she's doing. And then as I, as business went on, I would go out and meet people. And I eventually met her. And she was so warm and kind. And, you know, I would listen to her talk about money, and I would listen to her talk about her own journey, about when she was pretending to have it all together, when her money was really small, and how she had to come to terms with her stuff and how she was able to climb out of that. And now she helps, you know, women-identified business owners navigate their finances. And so I started following her on social media. I took, you know, some a couple freebies. You know, sometimes you have to pick up free breadcrumbs until you can actually afford a loaf of bread. So I kind of got to know her flow a little bit. And so I just, I, I just mustered up some courage one day. And I reached out to her and I said, Hey, so I'm thinking, I don't know, I don't know if you want to work with me, but and the interesting thing is that she was very excited that I reached out to her. She said, I've been paying attention to your business. You're doing really great things. And I said, Listen, I can't pay you this money all at once. And she said, That's fine. Let's work out a payment plan that works for you. And when we first met, we sat together for like a full day. First, she sent me some paperwork that I had to complete about, you know, giving her numbers so that she could look it over. And then we we met for the full day, and she did some some deep, what I would like to call deep work. I said to her, You're like my money therapist. Because she sat me down and she was like, Okay, so how do you feel when you look at these numbers? Yeah. And I boohooed a little bit. We put the embarrassment on the table, and she's like, Roxanne, you don't have anything to be ashamed about, to be ashamed of. This is just numbers, right? This doesn't make you a bad person. This doesn't make you an irresponsible person. Let's just find the whole. And we sat down together and we worked it out. And then we sat down and we came up with what she called a profit plan. And we, you know, she navigated all the things, and this is what this is what you do when you have associates, and this is what you do when you have, you know, when you're opening up a physical location. And it was just super helpful and it helped me recognize that I was, I was actually on the right path. I just needed some help.

SPEAKER_03:

I love that you went into such a deep description there. One of our other episodes, I interview um a financial therapist. Oh wow. There's so much about the topic of money that is emotional. Yes. So it's a nice thread. Uh so also I want to talk about something you've mentioned a couple of times, shame. Yeah, yes. So, in your playbook that you made for us that we post on our digital component of front desk, you mentioned, I think something Brene Brown said that shame is like mold. Could you talk about that for a little bit?

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, yes, yes. So um shame is this thing where it almost takes, we take on this thing as though we we have become this bad person, right? When I talk with clients, I say the difference between guilt and shame is that guilt says I've done a bad thing, shame says I am a bad person. And so we hold on to it personally. But the other thing about shame is that we hide it. And the more we hide it, the more devastating it can seem. And the longer we hide it, the more devastating it can seem. And Renee Brown says, shame is like mold, it grows in the dark. And so you have to shine a light on it, you have to um speak it openly. You have to be careful about who you speak it to, right? People have to earn that space of sharing.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_01:

But when you share in a safe space, it loses its power, right? Someone else helps you hold it, you shine a light on it, it gets smaller, it seems manageable, and you actually get support, right? And so the thing that you find yourself being ashamed of, whether you find a therapist or a best friend or someone in your family, it's really important to find a safe space, someone who you who cares about you, where you can put this on the table and say, here's a thing that I've been dealing with, and it loses its power, its hold on you.

SPEAKER_03:

So the takeaway is lots of people are out there feeling alone and like they aren't doing the right thing, but nobody's alone in doing that.

SPEAKER_01:

No, nobody's alone. Nobody's alone.

SPEAKER_02:

Hey there, Christina here. Just a quick moment to share that this episode is brought to you by Jane. We know how much heart you put into building a practice you're proud of, and that's why we're here. To make things like scheduling, charting, and payments run a little smoother. If you'd like to take a peek, head to jane.app forward slash pricing. Because we love a good bonus, don't forget to use the code RadioFrontdesk for a one-month grace period. Okay, I'll keep it short and sweet. Back to the episode.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay, let's talk about honesty and what you've been mentioning about like speaking your truth and finding appropriate people to do that with. Uh, because when you're in a leadership position or as a business owner, a solopreneur, you you were saying you can't just say it to anyone. That's not a good idea. So let's talk about that a little bit. And I think specifically, what does professional vulnerability look like?

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, professional vulnerability, first of all, you have to be careful about where you share. Social media is a very interesting place. And a coach said to me a long time, never put anything on social media that you wouldn't want on a billboard by the highway, right? Just be very careful about that. Um, be careful about sharing about your family, um, you know, finances, some things you want to keep closer to your chest. Um, but it's important to find another professional that um is either on the same level as you or maybe a couple of steps ahead of you who is willing to sit with you and offer even just the slightest bit of mentorship or find a coach that may be a paid position or voluntary, but find community, right? So maybe on a retreat or um a networking event where you can meet like-minded individuals. Maybe you meet once a month, every Wednesday over lunch, or something, and we share some of the same struggles that we're dealing with because when you are alone, it does, it plays a number on you, right? It's really important to recognize because you might find out that the thing that I'm struggling with, the thing that I'm beating myself for myself up for, is actually something that business owners all experience in year three. And it's year three for me. So it's not just me, this is just the path. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah. Interesting. I love that. I've had many mentors over the course of my life. I've I've run through this process many times. My question for you is what do you do if you do encounter somebody that isn't the right fit or can't hold what you have to share, or doesn't prove to be trustworthy, or you know, they just they they're not interested. So you've started to open up. What would you say if someone encounters something like that?

SPEAKER_01:

Um I use a lot of analogies all the time. And as you were you were just saying that, the thought that I had was going shopping. And you pick out a pair of jeans from the rack and you go into the dressing room and you put it on, or you try to put it on, yeah, and it won't get past your hips, right? A lot of people would be like, That's it. I hate shopping. I'm never coming back to this store. But you need the jeans. So you say to the sales girl, can you go up two sizes? You throw it over the door and you say, Can you get me another size? Right. Um, the same is true for people who are looking for a therapist. You might, you know, meet with someone, you open up the first session, and it doesn't really quite fit, you feel uncomfortable. Instead of leaving, saying this therapy is for birds, you say, I need to find someone else. And so it's the challenging part is that you've you've you've uh brought your vulnerable self to the forefront and you've opened up and you've shared, and this person can't hold it, and you're like, oh, this was hard, and now I'm disappointed. Um, first of all, I just want to commend anyone who's done this. I just want to commend them for literally bringing their vulnerable self to the front of the room, right? Now instead of packing that person away and saying you're never coming out again, you're gonna do your due diligence and see if there's anyone else who might have better capacity. And, you know, ask around. Do you know anyone who's a really good mentor? Have you worked with someone before? What do you think about so-and-so? Um, and if you're looking to work with someone, especially if this is someone that you have to go out of pocket for, ask them for references. It's totally fine to say, who have you worked with before? Is it okay if I reach out to them to see what they had to say? Right? Because this is this is deep work. So it it's worth the the um it's worth looking into.

SPEAKER_03:

So in your playbook, another line from it is other parts of my business I feel embarrassed about. Can you walk us through what you can learn from going through that exercise?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, because sometimes we have this, we have this feeling inside, this negative feeling, and we can't quite put our finger on it, right? And sometimes we show up in spaces and we talk and we laugh, and we think to ourselves, well, I'm not gonna tell anybody about that thing. I'm gonna keep that part a secret. And it goes back to the piece about shame is like mold, it grows in the dark, right? So when you ask yourself, okay, what is that thing that I don't really want to tell anybody about? It's like me when I was working with a financial strategist, right? I didn't want to tell anybody that I was couldn't manage financially. It felt like you're a bad business owner, right? Um, you don't know how to count. What's wrong with you? Right? And so I was really embarrassed about that. And so the thing that you're embarrassed about is a thing that needs to be addressed, right? And but the more you hide it, the more we're not addressing it, and the worse it's gonna get, and the worse you're gonna feel. So really check in and like give yourself like this hand-to-heart moment and say, okay, let me just do some introspection. What is this thing that I keep wanting to hide from everybody? Okay, who can I trust with this information? Because you have to get it for you have to get it outside of you. You have to speak to it. There is a uh a neuroscientist, uh Dan Siegel, who says you have to name it in order to tame it, right? If you don't, if you can't, if you can't identify what it is and speak to it, then we can't fix it, right? Right.

SPEAKER_03:

To close out, I want to bring us back to something very human. Yes. There are people out there right now who are actually in a rough season, maybe feeling shame, isolation, or like they're falling short. What would you say to one of those people?

SPEAKER_01:

I would say that you are, first of all, you are doing the thing. The only reason that you recognize that you're falling short is because you're actually actively out here doing the thing. Right? So, first of all, hats off, all the applause for being out here doing the thing. Because if you weren't trying, you wouldn't have had any reason to fall short. Um, second of all, understand that business is hard. Many of us went to school for whatever discipline it is that we're practicing, and they never taught us how to run a business. So you are literally, how do they, what did they say? Building the plane as you're flying it, right? Like and loving it. And so you're gonna have hiccups, right? You're not a bad person. You're not an incompetent person. Reach out for some support. There's no shame in asking for help, right? Um, you'd be surprised at how much your business can take off once you have the right support.

SPEAKER_03:

That's it for today's episode of Radio Front Us. Huge thanks to Roxanne Francis for reminding us that honesty and vulnerability aren't weaknesses. They're a part of what makes great leaders and strong business owners. If you'd like to explore more of Roxanne's insights on navigating shame, comparison, and finding support as a clinic owner, you can find her playbook linked in our show notes. Thanks for tuning in, and we'll see you next time.